Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Family Harrassment

Collapse
This topic is closed.
X
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Family Harrassment

    Dear all,



    I hope that you can help my family and I deal with a particularly aggressive and threatening neighbour.



    I recently lost my job due to a conviction (my own fault .. never to be repeated). Despite the trauma to my family and myself we have stuck together and want to rebuild our lives. However, our neighbour is determined to intimidate us out of our house.



    Every time we see each other (and I try not to) he hurls abuse. He has threatened me with physical violence. We have had our property vandalised (the police suspect it was him).



    I luckily managed to get another job and now work away during the week, coming home at weekends. Perhaps because of this he has turned his attentions to my wife. He has also threatened to have something done to my child by his children.



    At the moment, I am trying to show him that we are not intimidated - going about my business as usual, even though it may mean him deliberately coming outside to harress me.



    I have logged all the incidents, with times, dates, what was said, which can be witnessed etc. When I spoke to the police about it, they said 'wait and see' .. and .. 'you know if you prosecute him you'll be in the papers again as he'll go straight to them'. I know that is true .... we are rebuilding everything at the moment, but I don't want him to think he can get away with it.



    For the sake of my wife and child I hope to resolve this soon - either by legal action against him - or by moving (the market is dead though).



    Does anyone have advice?



    *edit - some details removed, I'm worried the NFH is reading this*
    Howard:"You wanna be careful, before you know it you'll wake up in a bush singing songs about brooms"



    Vince:"You don't know anything about me. Do you know anything about me?"



    Howard:"I know...of you"



    Vince:"Yeah, well, if you knew me you'd know that I don't sing songs about brooms...I sing songs about love...

    Lovely lady with the eye

    Lovely lady with the eye

    You've only got one but it's a good one

    Lovely lady with the eye, the eye, the eye, the eye, the eye

    coming forward on a string, thats not normal, urgh

    Yeah! I'm in a band..."

  • #2
    Hi freakyfun and welcome



    I think your case is an ideal one for the Protection from Harassment Act. You can download it and print it out from the legislation section on the main site.



    It is heartening to hear that other neighbours are sticking by you. You made a mistake, you owned up to it and you served your time vowing never to repeat that mistake. You should be allowed to enjoy your own home without all this harassment.



    Maybe your NFH will go to the newspapers but somehow if he is on the receiving end of a Prevention from Harassment Order he might not be so willing to do this. I think Spook mentioned in another post that breaking the order can result in five years imprisonment - I hardly think he would relish that.



    Your NFH has a problem and it's not with you, it's with himself. Keep logging the incidents and ask the police about the PHA. The only other thing I can think of is to get legal advice from a solicitor.



    Good luck, I'm sure other members will have more advice, sympathy and support for you.



    Misty
    "Almost anything you do will seem insignificant, but it is very important that you do it. You must be the change that you wish to see in the world." Gandhi

    Comment


    • #3
      Hi freakyfun and welcome to the Forum



      I completely agree with everything Misty has said - I think that you need to speak to the Police about them warning your nfh that if he continues behaving as he does, then they will initially give him a warning under the Protection from Harassment Act. That may be enough to stop him.



      You have learned and moved on - it's about time this person did too.



      Wishing you all the best.

      Comment


      • #4
        You have a multitude of issues going on here and it all culminates back to your conviction by the looks of things.



        Freakyfun

        Since then, every time we see each other (and I try not to) he hurls abuse. He has threatened me with physical violence. We have had our car and fence vandalised (the police suspect it was him).


        Join the club, vandalising fences is another of Madhatter's favourite tricks and proving it even though we called the police whilst he was doing it did not get us any further - yes thats right we had proof !



        Freakyfun



        I have logged all the incidents, with times, dates, what was said, which can be witnessed etc. When I spoke to the police about it, they said 'wait and see' .. and .. 'you know if you prosecute him you'll be in the papers again as he'll go straight to them'. I know that is true .... we are rebuilding everything at the moment, but I don't want him to think he can get away with it.


        So, tell me how does your conviction prevent you or the police (which it isn't technically its the Crown Prosection Service) from prosecuting him then ?



        If your NFH has committed a crime - why does that make him Mr Untouchable ?



        NO ONE IS ABOVE THE LAW



        Clearly this police officer has pointed out to you that your NFH will use it against you but if NFH has clearly committed an offence then your previous conviction should not come into play unless it is related to the offence carried out. You may get crossed questioned by the defence about it, but, its not relevant.



        If he goes to the papers again then surely the boot will be on the other foot as he will be marked as the aggressor as opposed to the victim he is lining himself up as.



        Get more evidence and start giving your community officer some serious questions. This NFH needs to be told that his behaviour is unacceptable.

        Comment


        • #5
          Hi Freakyfun(great name!)



          Sorry you're having such intimidation.



          And sorry to harp on my usual question...but it would help to understand whether you and nfh are owner-occupiers, or in rented accommodation. Nuisance/harassment is a breach of tenancy obligations that a council/Housing Association should take very seriously.



          Take care





          Sapph

          Comment


          • #6
            Dear all,



            Thanks for all your advice.



            Scooby, the conviction is unrelated to any offence my NFH may have carried out, but you are right in that it is what set him off. He has decided that he doesn't want me living next to him. Personally I can understand that, but he is unaware of all the facts. I did something stupid, I have paid the price (lost job, respect, standing) I'm not going to do it again. I'm not a threat to him or his family. As others have said, I have moved on and am trying to build my life again, I have a new job, which I love. My friends and family still want to know me, my other neighbours do not act in the same way as this man, he simply wants me out, based on his own ignorant viewpoint.



            My only conclusion about the police, is that as I have a record, they are unprepared to do anything because a) I deserve it in their opinion, or B) They are genuinely concerned this man may do something nasty if provoked. 'and you wouldn't want that would you .. best to let it lie and move away'



            Perhaps B) is the right course of action.



            One thing I have thought about is the effect of making a formal complaint on us selling our house ... we would have to disclose it ... would anyone want to live next to someone who can be so vindictive?



            I just hope none of his other neighbours 'upset' him in any way. (perhaps that in itself is reason enough to fight our corner)



            I don't know.



            I want something done about him, but I don't want to provoke him. The police seem to be unwilling to deal with it. I will see what happens next weekend when I go to do my garden at the front again.



            Hmm .. lots of mixed messages there ... as you can tell its all a bit much at the moment, especially having to leave my wife and child there during the week on their own!



            FF



            *edit - some details removed*
            Howard:"You wanna be careful, before you know it you'll wake up in a bush singing songs about brooms"



            Vince:"You don't know anything about me. Do you know anything about me?"



            Howard:"I know...of you"



            Vince:"Yeah, well, if you knew me you'd know that I don't sing songs about brooms...I sing songs about love...

            Lovely lady with the eye

            Lovely lady with the eye

            You've only got one but it's a good one

            Lovely lady with the eye, the eye, the eye, the eye, the eye

            coming forward on a string, thats not normal, urgh

            Yeah! I'm in a band..."

            Comment


            • #7
              Sorry, I keep forgetting the this website turns b's into B)



              Freakyfun
              Howard:"You wanna be careful, before you know it you'll wake up in a bush singing songs about brooms"



              Vince:"You don't know anything about me. Do you know anything about me?"



              Howard:"I know...of you"



              Vince:"Yeah, well, if you knew me you'd know that I don't sing songs about brooms...I sing songs about love...

              Lovely lady with the eye

              Lovely lady with the eye

              You've only got one but it's a good one

              Lovely lady with the eye, the eye, the eye, the eye, the eye

              coming forward on a string, thats not normal, urgh

              Yeah! I'm in a band..."

              Comment


              • #8
                I want something done about him, but I don't want to provoke him. The police seem to be unwilling to deal with it. I will see what happens next weekend when I go to do my garden at the front again. (with a tape recorder and video camera perhaps?)



                Hmm .. lots of mixed messages there ... as you can tell its all a bit much at the moment, especially having to leave my wife and daughter there during the week on their own!


                Just a mega quickie reply so this is a short but sweet response until I am about later on this evening but, what about your wife making a complaint.



                She has done nothing wrong has she ? She is fear of reprisals because of this individuals behaviour. This is not nice for your family I can understand your worries, but, regardless of what you have done, we have laws in the country that we are supposed to abide by. If you feel that you are not being taken seriously then yes do gather evidence the more you have to your bow the better. But, your wife and children deserve just as much protection from this loon that the laws in this country can muster.



                I'll have a think about your situation and come back later I am off today so I shall have a more clearer head to crunch it through my mind.

                Comment


                • #9




                  Just reading about your situation, you have paid for your mistake but this man thinks you still need your nose rubbed in it a bit more.



                  I would carry a dictaphone around so you can capture any rude comments he makes and maybe a cctv in case he thinks he might like to cause damage to your property. the good thing is your other neighbours are ok with you, so i wonder if you completely blank him and carry on with your life as though he wasnt there if eventually he will shut up???



                  does he live on his own???? is he in a council property?



                  he is definitely harrassing you and you should try and get an order against him.



                  and if he thinks he can go to the papers about you - how about you get there first??????? you are trying to rebuild your life and he is sabotaging it by being so petty minded.........



                  :ban: :nfh1:
                  http://bestsmileys.com/sparkle/1.gif



                  I decree today that life

                  Is simply taking and not giving

                  England is mine - it owes me a living

                  But ask me why, and I'll spit in your eye

                  Oh, ask me why, and I'll spit in your eye ~ Morrisey/Marr




                  Politics is Showbusiness for ugly people ~ Jay Leno



                  I don't like liars, I don't like cheats. I don't like bullsh***ters. I don't like schmoozers. I don't like ar*e-lickers. ~ Sir Alan Sugar



                  "Why, Sir, you find no man, at all intellectual, who is willing to leave London. No, Sir, when a man is tired of London, he is tired of life; for there is in London all that life can afford." ~ Samuel Johnson



                  The secret of success is the capacity to overcome failure ~ Noel Coward



                  An economist is an expert who will know tomorrow why the things he predicted yesterday didn’t happen today ~ Laurence J. Peter



                  Always laugh when you can. It is cheap medicine ~ Lord Byron



                  Better bread with water than cake with trouble ~ Russian Proverb



                  There is no trouble so great or grave that cannot be much diminished by a cup of tea ~ Bernard-Paul Heroux



                  Carpe Diem



                  Give Yourself to It ~ Sue Gadenne

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I have had a look through some of the issues that you have raised here about your many concerns with your neighbours behaviour, the law and how it affects both you and your family.



                    Just looking at it objectively and taking on board what you have stated herein, there are several prongs that I can look at and offer basic advice on. As Beth has pointed out earlier we are – and I am not – trained legal professionals. I am having to read and study the law to keep fully informed of our rights as regards Madhatter and his actions.



                    I think that by just looking at it from the point that you raised about the fence – I feel very much that you are in the same boat as us, in that the police will advise that this is a civil matter and it will come under a Civil Tort. Its very disheartening I know and although our case went through to the CPS after much haggling from me, they advised both the police and us to seek redress through the civil courts.



                    Regardless of what the law states, it is how it is interpreted in a court of law by the solicitors/barristers acting on your behalf. We all see things differently and the courts are no different. Each and every case is unique with a completely different set of circumstances being attached to it. This is where both the solicitors and barristers and in certain cases QC’s enter into protracted legal arguments and how the law should be interpreted. Even High Courts Judge’s get it wrong.



                    I feel this should centre on Breach of the Peace – which essentially it is. Below I have given you a particular case law which will interest you and others here on the forum.



                    Neighbourly Dispute



                    John & Pauline Barlow suffered six years of almost daily abuse from their neighbours in Richmond, North Yorkshire. They believed that the cause of the problem was a bathroom extension that was built by Mr Barlow which overlooked his neighbours property.



                    Rotten apples, stones, coal, chicken carcasses, buckets of water and insults were hurled at the Barlow’s and their property. Their children received nuisance calls. Even the high boundary wall did not prevent Brian Zipfell and Phyllis Hird from climbing a step ladder in order to stare at the Barlow’s.



                    Decision



                    In 1995, magistrates found Brian Zipfell and Phyllis Hird guilty of a Breach of the Peace, disorderly behaviour and harassment. Mr Zipfell was bound over for two years for £2,000, while sentence on Ms Hird was adjourned pending submission of psychiatric reports.




                    Typically here, the burden of proof is on you to gather the evidence and present it to the police. Harassment can be difficult to prove (that’s the law on it) particularly when for example it takes the form of distressing noise or abusive behaviour. This is when the Breach of the Peace comes into play.



                    I can sit here and write a long list of sections and sub-sections of the law regarding your neighbour that I have dug up, and without doubt your neighbour is not that far off Madhatter’s carryings on; but, as we are both painfully aware it is difficult just gaining the evidence and even when you have collected the evidence, it seems that it is still not enough.



                    Your local police authority are duty bound to act if an offence has been committed, whether or not you have a criminal conviction. You have the same rights as everyone else and I fail to see how you can be singled out for this. I feel that perhaps a visit to a solicitor and having a letter fired off to your NFH might do the trick. I know with some others here it has worked when it has been pointed out to NFH that their actions are not acceptable and right. I’ll be honest I cannot remember who these individuals are – someone else might, Matthew has a pretty good grasp on the backgrounds of us members, so maybe he might be able to give you some direction. Likewise, some other members will no doubt be able to offer their help here too.



                    I have tried to keep this fairly straight forward for you, I don’t want to start going down the line of injunctions and restraining orders because I feel it’s just going to bog you down. I think the old maxim – well cross that bridge when we come to it – applies here.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Decision time:



                      Should I let him know he's being recorded though, if I want to use the tape in court? :huh:



                      Should I tell him that his behaviour amounts to an offence under the 'Protection from Harressment Act'? :huh:



                      Should I just record his outburst then blank him?



                      Should I go over and punch him for insulting my wife last weekend? (I don't mean that, but its how I feel sometimes) :angry:



                      Freakyfun
                      Howard:"You wanna be careful, before you know it you'll wake up in a bush singing songs about brooms"



                      Vince:"You don't know anything about me. Do you know anything about me?"



                      Howard:"I know...of you"



                      Vince:"Yeah, well, if you knew me you'd know that I don't sing songs about brooms...I sing songs about love...

                      Lovely lady with the eye

                      Lovely lady with the eye

                      You've only got one but it's a good one

                      Lovely lady with the eye, the eye, the eye, the eye, the eye

                      coming forward on a string, thats not normal, urgh

                      Yeah! I'm in a band..."

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Hi freakyfun



                        All I can do, is let you know what I'd do in your situation. Don't know whether that would be right or wrong .



                        I'd record anything the nfh said - without telling them they're being recorded.



                        I wouldn't say anything about their behaviour being something covered by the PHA 97.



                        I'd just carry on in my garden and try and blank them as much as possible.



                        Regarding the thumping - just keep that image in your mind :P .



                        Let us know what happens - keep safe and take care.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          freakyfun,



                          I've only just come across your posting. You have already been given some great advice and I'll try not to repeat any of it.



                          I know only too well what it is like to be on the wrong side of the law. Even though this individual may hold it against you, I would advise you try not to hold it against yourself. This individual as taken it upon himself to be judge, jury and executioner.



                          At the end of the day who does he think he is? There is not a single person that, as not done something they regret.



                          " Let him with out sin cast the first stone". I'm sure this moral crusader who as taken it upon himself to punish you further, is no angel. From what you have said, he certainly isn't.



                          You are entitled to the same protection by the law as anybody else and as Scooby said, nobody is above the law. If this individual breaks the law, please don't feel they will dismiss you because you made a mistake.



                          As tempting as it may be to have a " chat " with this bloke, please don't. People like this can quickly twist the truth and unfortunately the downside to your situation is that your past will be looked at. You are rebuilding your life, please don't let a narrow minded moron like this bring it all crashing down again.



                          You made a mistake, you have been punished. I was advised to stop beating myself up over it, I would like to give you the same advice.



                          Take care, try not to let him grind you down Kevin

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Agree with Kevin, freakyfun!! No one is without their own past, and you have every right to protection from the law for you and your family!



                            I don't think you owe him any warning re. any action you are taking to protect yourself in terms of logging incidents, recording evidence. As long as you are not pointing cctv cameras in his window, you arenot invading his privacy.



                            Hope you can get some action against nfh soon!

                            :ban:

                            Sapph

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Hi there,

                              You have some sound advice, I am waving a hand of support your way



                              Stay proud



                              Idgy

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X